After neoliberal offensive times, in which the movement adopted a "defensive posture" Walden Bello points to opportunities to take the offensive at the time that the system "is collapsed" DIAGONAL : Is this the end of financial capitalism?
WALDEN BELLO: It's hard to talk about the end of capitalism because capitalism is very flexible. And you can have capitalism with a social image globally and in my opinion, Obama represents the kind of capitalist reform, a new class compromise with some reforms to the north and corporations business dealings with the South. But the underlying idea is that countries impose some stability to allow the reproduction of capitalism, which supports the great benefits of transnational corporations. So we should be aware that the solution is not regulation, has to be something far more transformative. We really should talk about the empowerment of citizens.
This is an opportunity for us to be able to promote a deeper transformation and gradual economic organization and go beyond simple market regulation reform proposal from capitalism. Capitalism will not disappear unless we organize for a post-capitalist system.
D.: What role should play now social movements?
WB: The social movements should let their imagination flowing and join forces to organize the world at local, national and international in a new, different. At this time the battle cry should be a real democracy, democratic participation.
International networks and anti-globalization movements should take to promote this democratic vision of the world that goes beyond social regulation established by social stabilization programs driven by the G-20 and Obama. It is tempting for social movements to agree with people like Obama when he says the most important thing now is to deal with emergencies, when he says "Do not think in those dreams strategic, we must work together to stop the global crisis."
I think being seduced by these ideas is wrong because we will not get out of this crisis with short-term solutions to stabilize the new capitalism. The only way that really will leave this capitalist crisis is pushing and fighting to get a vision, a transformational process and structure with which we organize our national and international economy. And this really the imagination plays an important role.
In the '80s, because of the terrible brutality of the neoliberal offensive, people acted defensively thinking "let's protect what we have," and even today many maintain this defensive position. But what has changed is that this system has collapsed and people are really looking for alternatives, so we should provide them because people are sick of capitalist organization of the world are tired of so much alienation, many structures that create poverty, of the economic gaps that separate people. People really are looking for new ways of organizing more cooperative economy away from that selfish individualism and neoliberalism proposed. If we no respondemos a esas demandas de la gente que busca cooperación, que busca una democracia real, otros lo harán, otros que dirán que son antineoliberales, que realmente quieren el cambio, pero que en el fondo su intención es proponer programas mucho más peligrosos, que dejen fuera a muchas personas, que las separen en vez de unirlas. Así que nuestra responsabilidad es liberar la imaginación y ser capaces de ofrecer formas nuevas de cooperación y organización económica.
D.: EL G-20 ha decidido triplicar los fondos del Fondo Monetario Internacional (FMI). Ante el fallo de las instituciones neoliberales hay quien habla de un nuevo Bretton Woods.
W. B.: No necesitamos un new Bretton Woods, in fact do not need a Bretton Woods. The best solution for all would abolish the IMF, the World Bank and World Trade Organization (WTO) because they are central institutions which promote the system of the North and the interests of transnational corporations and basically supports his agenda in a systematic way for corporations .
From the South must confront these institutions who want to look more social, but really just looking to stabilize global capitalism instead of transforming the world in the interest of the population. Southern countries need to create their own institutions and stop relying on others who are promoted and abducted by the interests of transnational corporations.
D.: What is China's position on this crisis?
WB: In terms of the global economy over recent years, China and the U.S. have been dance partners. China manufactured products are sold to U.S. consumers and China lends money to the United States to keep pace with consumption of U.S. citizens. So this has been dancing in the global economy over recent years. However, due to the collapse of U.S. consumer credit, China's export industries are suffering.
So I think there will be a very hard struggle in China between two streams of different leadership, those who think the country needs to refocus its growth in domestic demand and those who are committed to wait out the crisis and U.S. consumers buy things again. So China is at a crossroads: either try to recover and encourage domestic demand or still playing the role of exporter of low price and basing its economy on exports. I think this will be a major political battle in China because the transformation does not come just saying you're going to stimulate domestic demand, you have to create new structures that have an income farmers, have to change the whole pattern of agriculture subject to the industry.
China may choose to address a sustainable development path based on an internal distribution of income or continue down the same path by joining the major economic powers, which became the largest factory in the world and the lender of large sums of money North.
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